“Anti-Racism Requires UNITY!” An interview with Sarah Feng honoring AAPI Heritage Month

This is the ARCC of Change with Donzel Leggett, a podcast from the Anti-Racism Commitment Coalition, an organization dedicated to eradicating racism and hate and spreading anti-racism. Listen as Donzel talks about relevant topics that will inspire you and help build your capability to take action and change the world. Because none of us are doing enough as long as racism still exists. And now, here's your host, Donzel Leggett.

Donzel Leggett: Hello, and welcome to the fifth episode of Season Two of the ARCC of Change with Donzel Leggett. In this episode, I will briefly discuss the horror of the most recent mass shootings in the United States and what must be done to stop them. I will also honor Asian American and Pacific Islander Heritage Month by welcoming ARCC member Sarah Feng back to the show to discuss the complicated history of the relationship between Asian Americans and African Americans. Understanding, acknowledging, and taking action to change this history to one of unity will be required to spread anti-racism. Now, let's get started with our show.

So, I am Donzel Leggett, host of the ARCC of Change podcast and founder of the Anti-Racism Commitment Coalition, or ARCC. Our vision at ARCC is to build a racism-free world. Our mission is to provide inspiration, education, and support for you to transform yourself and to practice and spread anti-racism.

This begins with our process of personally transforming yourself toward anti-racism. There are three steps. The first is erasing your ignorance about racism and hate. The second is educating yourself about anti-racism. The third, and most important, is building the character and confidence to stand up, speak out, and take action to spread anti-racism and make a positive change.

Now, I have to start this episode by talking about the horrific mass murders in Buffalo, New York, and Uvalde, Texas. In Buffalo, 10 people were brutally killed in a mostly Black neighborhood. In Uvalde, Texas, 21 people were killed, 19 of them elementary school children, almost all Latino. You may not have heard of this next one because it was thankfully less deadly, but there was also a mass shooting in the last month at a Taiwanese church in Laguna Woods, California, targeting Asian Americans.

These are all just the latest in what seems to be a regular occurrence—not seems to be; it is a regular occurrence in the United States. I can back that up with numbers. Already this year, there have been more mass shootings than days of the year. A mass shooting is defined as an event in which four or more people are shot. There have been over 200 mass shootings in the United States in just the first 148 days of this year.

It's a sad fact, but it is the truth. Unfortunately, it's not new. We're the only country in the developed world—a country with a highly developed economy—in which this happens. No other country with a developed economy has anywhere near the prevalence of mass shootings that the United States does.

We don't know the exact motives behind all mass shootings. Certainly, we don't know all the facts about the last three I mentioned, but there is very strong evidence that the Buffalo shooting and the Laguna Hills shooting were motivated by hate and racism.

We know for a fact that all these shootings were enabled by the ease of obtaining guns in this country. And not just handguns, but military-grade assault rifles designed for the purpose of killing as many people as quickly as possible. It's easy to obtain these weapons in the United States.

What are we doing? What are we doing? Innocent people are being killed. Our children are being slaughtered. After every one of these tragic incidents, no new gun laws are passed at the national level. Not one. Not after the Virginia Tech University shooting 15 years ago. Not one law was passed after the Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting in Newtown, Connecticut, almost 10 years ago. No new gun laws have been passed since the Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School shooting in Parkland, Florida, almost five years ago.

Instead, we've seen several states pass laws that weaken gun-control laws, making it even easier for people to get these weapons of mass destruction. Even sadder, the trend after every one of these shootings is that no new national laws are passed to reduce the ease of obtaining these guns.

Instead of seeing fewer guns on the streets, what we actually see is higher gun sales. Yes, more guns are sold after these shootings. Again, what are we doing?

We know how to stop this. It's not difficult to understand. It's very clear what has to be done. The question is, do we have the resolve?

The motives behind these shootings are hard to figure out in every case. There are many reasons why people resort to violence and take the step of carrying out mass shootings. We all have to work together continually to address these various issues. That includes people working on the economy to make sure people have gainful employment, the work we're doing at ARCC to spread anti-racism and anti-hate, and the work many other organizations are doing to address the various reasons why people resort to these actions.

But there's no doubt that the severity of these actions is due to the easy availability of military-grade guns. That availability allows these actions to escalate from a single incident affecting one or two people into events involving mass destruction, mass carnage, mass murder, and mass death.

This is what's different about the United States. Ninety percent of Americans understand this. They understand that we have to do something about the proliferation of guns. They support implementing basic national gun-safety laws, such as universal background checks and red-flag laws. Yet there's a faction of lawmakers, and we all know who they are, who simply don't care and refuse to do anything. Not one thing.

The only way this is going to change, the only way to start saving innocent people's lives, and the only way to stop the senseless slaughter of our children is for us to stand up, speak out, and take action. Transform ourselves, and have the confidence to transform others—our friends, our family, and our coworkers—to force action by these lawmakers. If they don't act, vote them out. This is the only way to make change happen.

Now, this episode is not dedicated to the problem of mass shootings, but I felt it was so important to talk about these shootings to start the episode. I promise I'll do another episode in the very near future dedicated to this issue, so please watch for it in the coming months.

For this episode, I want to switch gears and focus on honoring Asian American and Pacific Islander Heritage Month, which closes out in just a few days at the end of May. At the same time, I want to use this opportunity to showcase what ARCC members are all about, which is actually what I just talked about: people who are willing to stand up, speak out, and take sustained action.

That means not just doing something once or twice, but continuously doing things to drive the positive change needed to combat, neutralize, and eradicate racism and hate. It means continually learning and transforming yourself, and continuing to build the character, courage, and confidence needed to spread anti-racism by influencing and helping others transform and adopt anti-racism.

You can do this by having real conversations and sharing what you've learned, whether one-on-one, in small groups with a couple of friends, in large public arenas, or through public media and social media.

Now, I have a special guest today: Sarah Feng, who personifies what I just talked about. She personifies what ARCC is all about. Sarah is a longtime ARCC volunteer who also happens to be a truly remarkable young woman who exemplifies commitment to the ARCC vision and mission.

Sarah is here today to share some research she did on her own. She decided she wanted to learn more, so she researched Asian American and Pacific Islander Heritage Month, focusing specifically on the histories of Asian Americans and African Americans: how their histories are similar and different, where there has been conflict and why, and how their communities are connected and support one another.

More importantly, we'll discuss how this relationship illustrates that achieving our vision—building a racism-free world and spreading anti-racism—will require unity.

I'm going to take a short break, and we'll come right back with our special guest, Sarah Feng.

The ARCC of Change podcast is brought to you by the Anti-Racism Commitment Coalition. Visit joinarcc.org to learn more about ARCC and join our movement.

Donzel Leggett: All right, welcome back to the ARCC of Change with Donzel Leggett. As promised, I have my special guest on, and that is Sarah Feng.

Sarah, welcome back to the ARCC of Change. How are you doing today?

Sarah Feng: Good. Thank you so much for having me again.

Donzel Leggett: Awesome, Sarah. I want to thank you for being on the show. I don't know if you know this, but you're achieving another first. When you were here in January for our first episode of Season Two, you appeared with Valerie and Rosa on A New Hope. That was the first time I'd had multiple guests on a show and the first time we'd had high schoolers on the ARCC of Change. But it's another first today. You're the first person to appear twice as a guest on the ARCC of Change. So, Sarah, once again, making history!

I've known you since you were 10 or 11 years old, something like that, and it's awesome to see how you've grown into this wonderful young woman. Thank you for all the great time you're putting into ARCC. You've been one of our most dedicated volunteers, doing tremendous work, whether on social media or wherever we need you. I really appreciate that.

Again, for those who may not remember you from when you were here in January, you introduced yourself then. I think it would be good for you to give us a quick introduction to who Sarah Feng is.

Sarah Feng: Thank you, Donzel. I'm Sarah. I'm 17, almost a senior, and I'm ending my junior year in high school right now. I'm Chinese American, and I live in Minnesota. I go to Breck School.

Donzel Leggett: Yeah. Again, thank you so much for that introduction.

You did it! You introduced yourself, and you did a wonderful job. I said some really good things about you in the prior segment, but they're all true. You just finished your junior year. A lot of us who are listening, myself included, were in high school a long time ago, but I still remember some highlights.

What are a couple of highlights from your junior year that you think were big for you?

Sarah Feng: I think this year definitely had the most semblance of normal that I've had for a long time. Everyone was back on campus. We went maskless at the end of the year, too. Just being back, seeing everyone, and adjusting to being on campus every day was really fun. It was great to see faces again and be in class. Junior year was definitely stressful, but working through all these challenges and now being on the other side of it feels really rewarding.

Donzel Leggett: Yeah, yeah. It's been quite the run, and the summer obviously is here now.

What plans do you have? Any big plans this summer?

Sarah Feng: I'm going to spend a lot of time at the art studio. I go to an art studio in Shoreview, and I want to work on some art to get ready for my portfolio. But art is also just fun, so that'll be fun for me. Hopefully, I'll do a lot of work with art and maybe an internship.

Donzel Leggett: Yep, awesome. We can't wait to have you work with us doing some internship work. We've got some big things going on.

You mentioned art, and you're very talented. I remember when you first joined ARCC, you put up a profile picture of a drawing you did of a young African American man. I thought the message was really powerful. I'm wondering what inspires you in your art.

This is the last question before I let you get into the topic we want to talk about. I've seen your work, and it's really wonderful. What are your main inspirations? What do you love spending your time trying to bring to life through your art?

Sarah Feng: I'm really inspired by what's going on in the world currently. I really like highlighting normal, everyday scenes. That's been a recent focus of mine. I did a piece with a mom feeding her child, for example, highlighting the beauty of everyday moments and small moments we see around us but often overlook. So, that's been a main source of inspiration recently.

Donzel Leggett: All right, all right. Well, let's get into it.

Sarah, you contacted me about three or four weeks ago. You sent me an email saying you'd been doing some research in preparation for Asian American and Pacific Islander Heritage Month. You wanted to learn about the histories of Asian American and African American relationships—how the communities have related, where there have been issues and problems, what the struggles have been, and where there have been similarities and differences.

You brought this to my attention and said you'd like to share what you learned from your research. I said, "What about coming on the podcast?" And you said, "Sure!" You were excited about it right away.

You and I have talked a little since then and shared some ideas. I'm very excited to hear your findings and your perspective today. I'm prepared to give you whatever time and freedom of expression you need to take us through this topic, tell us what you learned, and explain why you chose it. You came to me with this idea, so what were your key findings, and what do you want people to take away from them?

You've got a large audience willing to listen. The floor is yours, Sarah.

Sarah Feng: Okay, thank you so much. As Donzel mentioned, May is Asian American and Pacific Islander Heritage Month. It marks a time when we, as a nation, can reflect on and recognize the achievements of Asian Americans. It's also a time to explore the diversity and beauty of all the cultures encompassed by the Asian American and Pacific Islander community and how they've influenced and shaped America today.

This month, however, we've also seen devastating acts of hate that have been highlighted in the news. I know you mentioned this before in the segment you recorded earlier. Locally, there were some anti-Muslim mosque attacks, and then, obviously, the Buffalo shooting, fueled by racism and hatred toward Black people, along with countless other instances of hate that go unaddressed or unreported.

Racism constantly affects society. With these headlines receiving national coverage during AAPI Heritage Month, I thought an interesting way to combine these themes in this podcast would be to take a deep dive into inspiring examples of cross-cultural activism involving the Asian community, while also highlighting the work of Asian civil rights activists like Yuri Kochiyama.

Additionally, I think it's necessary, as you said, to uncover the history of racial wedges and divisions between the Asian American community and other minority groups, particularly the African American community. I want to explore these interactions and their intersections.

I hope that by doing so, we can shed light on how the animosity and tensions we see today between these two groups are rooted in the artificial practice of pitting minorities against one another. These divisions have been perpetuated by racist systems and, quite frankly, white supremacy in general.

By educating our own communities, I think we can move past these internalized biases and recognize that we're all in this universal fight—not against each other, but against racism as a whole. Racism is destructive to humanity in general. Understanding this is also important for preventing the kinds of racism we've seen this month. We need to recognize that this fight requires unity and cross-cultural activism.

Before I jump into some of the things I've mentioned, I want to make clear that the struggles of Asian Americans and African Americans are not all the same, and this isn't a competition. We often hear the term "oppression Olympics." That's not what this is. We can't equate the experiences of the two groups, but we can see that much of what we experience today stems from the same source.

I want to raise awareness of how closely the histories of both groups are linked rather than compare them or turn them into a competition.

I'm going to start by talking about the model minority myth, which I think is one of the most divisive tools used to pit Asian Americans against other minorities.

The term "model minority myth" was actually coined by a white sociologist in 1966. It refers to the idea that Asian Americans are a model minority, or an example to other minority groups of how to achieve success. It's the stereotype that Asians are hardworking, obedient, and well-behaved, as opposed to so-called "problem minorities."

White America holds Asian Americans up as an example to suggest that America is colorblind. It's presented as proof of America's meritocracy and creates the myth that America provides equal opportunities for all people of color.

I think another interesting point is America's restrictive history on immigration, specifically from Asia. This includes the Chinese Exclusion Act in 1886 and later immigration quotas. Then, even in 1965, when the United States ended quota-based immigration systems, it began pushing instead for highly skilled workers to enter the country. As a result, the Asians who immigrated were often handpicked groups with higher education and class status. This shows how flawed the model minority myth is.

Sarah Feng: The model minority myth not only creates divisions and racial wedges, but it also dramatically generalizes Asian Americans as a whole. Asia is an entire continent. Asian Americans are not a monolith in any way.

Even though it may look as though Asian Americans have the highest income of all minority groups, they also have the widest income gap of any minority group. I think that speaks volumes about how generalizing this stereotype is.

I wanted to include this explanation of the model minority myth to emphasize how artificial some of the tensions between minority groups are and how flawed those tensions can be. It shows how these divisions were created to divert attention and energy away from the bigger picture of combating white supremacy and racism, allowing people in power to maintain their positions.

Another notable division between Asian Americans and Black Americans involves the 1991 killing of Latasha Harlins and the subsequent Los Angeles riots following the beating of Rodney King.

Latasha Harlins was a young Black girl who was shot and killed by a Korean grocery store owner. The store owner later received an extremely light sentence of about five years' probation and some community service. This further exacerbated existing tensions between Asian Americans and African American residents in the Los Angeles area.

These tensions were fueled by negative depictions of both groups in mainstream American media, which were shaped by xenophobia and racism. The model minority myth also contributed, as did economic competition between the groups, who were often concentrated in economically disadvantaged areas.

Later, the L.A. riots occurred following the Rodney King case. Just a quick correction: Rodney King wasn't killed. He was severely beaten, but he didn't die at that time. The verdict did, however, spark the L.A. riots.

Donzel Leggett: Go ahead. Sorry about that. I just wanted to make sure that was corrected.

Sarah Feng: Oh, yeah, thank you so much. Right, and then, as you said, it sparked these riots. As a result, a lot of Korean American businesses were targeted during the riots. Much of that was fueled by the tensions that had been building, including those surrounding Latasha Harlins.

I think it shows how hate and violence, and the biases that have formed, can result in so much hatred, violence, and resentment between two groups. Understanding this history of tension, where it came from, and the events that caused it to boil over is important.

Now, I want to shift some attention to cross-cultural activism, highlighting Asian American civil rights activists like Yuri Kochiyama and examples of cross-cultural activism more broadly.

Basically, in the 1960s, students from different ethnic backgrounds, including Asian American and African American students, formed the Third World Liberation Front. They organized strikes that led to ethnic studies programs and more equal educational opportunities. It was a great example of the power of cross-cultural activism.

There were also examples during World War II, when Japanese Americans were sent to internment camps under the Emergency Detention Act. Black leaders were active in trying to repeal it.

Another example is the murder of Vincent Chin, an Asian American who was beaten to death on the streets. Black activists like Jesse Jackson spoke out about his death and advocated for reform and justice.

Even Frederick Douglass spoke out against the Chinese Exclusion Act. I didn't know that before. I didn't know that. That's a great learning experience for me.

Donzel Leggett: Yeah, he spoke a lot about how important it was for us to unite against wrongdoing and discrimination against any race or group. He emphasized that it was everyone's responsibility to do so.

Sarah Feng: There are a lot of examples. Black Americans mobilized to pressure President Franklin D. Roosevelt to establish the Fair Employment Practices Committee. There was also the Yellow Peril movement connected to the Black Panther movement. These examples show how the two groups united during the civil rights era to fight for social justice, racial justice, and human rights.

Then there's Yuri Kochiyama. She was a good friend of Malcolm X. She was there for his assassination and was deeply inspired by his work. She joined his group and advocated for racial justice and human rights. She was also a strong advocate for Puerto Rican independence. As a Japanese American and Asian American woman, she was incredibly inspiring in how active she was in empowering different groups.

Donzel Leggett: She was incredible. Incredible. If people haven't heard of Yuri Kochiyama, they need to Google her and learn a little about her. She was absolutely incredible.

I had to mention her because I didn't even know who she was until last year, when I did some research. It's a shame, because she was there. She was there. So keep going. Sorry about that.

Sarah Feng: Sure. I first learned about her when I saw a picture of Malcolm X with an Asian woman in the background. Her work is definitely really inspiring.

Donzel Leggett: And, in fact, as you said, she was there when Malcolm X was shot. She was embracing him and actually holding his head up so he could breathe until he died. That's how close she was to him, and she refused to leave his side even in that dangerous moment.

Again, learn about Yuri Kochiyama. Sorry about that, Sarah.

Sarah Feng: Thank you. For sure.

Today, we also see cross-cultural activism through Stop AAPI Hate and Black Lives Matter. In 2020, during the Black Lives Matter protests, young Asian Americans rallied and participated in the protests. And, conversely, when Asian hate crimes were especially bad, Black activists and leaders spoke out against anti-Asian hate.

Even though we still see points of tension, stereotypes, and biases today, we can also see moments of empowerment through cross-cultural activism. I think that's the message: understanding how powerful it is to work together and understanding the roots of existing biases. We need to use that knowledge to educate our communities and ourselves, confront those biases, and identify their roots. That's really important to advancing unity and cross-cultural activism.

Donzel Leggett: Fantastic.

Sarah Feng: Thank you.

Donzel Leggett: Visit us at joinarcc.org. Follow us on Instagram, LinkedIn, and Twitter, and like us on Facebook.

So, can I ask you some questions? Because that was phenomenal.

One thing I think is really interesting about what you just explained is the history of the model minority myth. I'm not sure if you're familiar with this, but the idea didn't start in 1967. I can't remember the person who coined the term at the time, but the concept actually goes back to the turn of the twentieth century.

In the early 1900s, there was a gentleman named Booker T. Washington. He was an African American leader, and there was another African American leader named W.E.B. Du Bois. They had competing views about the period after slavery and Reconstruction and the best way for African Americans to integrate into society.

W.E.B. Du Bois's view was that African Americans should have full equality and participate fully in society. To do that, they needed to get educated and should be able to rise up like everyone else.

Booker T. Washington's view was different. His view was pretty much what this model minority perspective is. He believed that African Americans should focus on technical jobs, develop technical skills, be obedient, avoid causing trouble, keep their houses and yards clean, and keep their heads down. Over time, the majority would accept them.

That approach is where this model-minority perspective of how to gain acceptance came from. As you can imagine, it created a rift within African American society. Many Black people believed in Booker T. Washington. He started the Tuskegee Institute, which you may have heard of, a famous historically Black institution. But many others disagreed because they felt his approach meant accepting subjugation.

Had you heard about Booker T. Washington and this idea of what Black people should do to achieve acceptance in the white world?

Sarah Feng: We studied Booker T. Washington and W.E.B. Du Bois in school, in U.S. history and other classes. But I guess I never really connected their conflicting ideas and ideals to the model minority myth. That's very interesting.

Donzel Leggett: It's one of those things that, in Black culture, has carried on. Even when Dr. Martin Luther King was bringing his message about breaking down segregation and achieving equality, Malcolm X had a different view.

Dr. King emphasized nonviolence and, in some people's minds, acceptance. Malcolm X's view was almost the opposite: "No, we want what we deserve. We demand what we deserve."

There's always been this kind of split, and I think it's one reason for the tension. There are many reasons for the tension between the two communities, but I think one is the pent-up anger in the Black community after years of trying the acceptance route and never really feeling like it's gone anywhere.

There's also the feeling that, after 400 years of being told to obey, people don't want to obey anymore. They believe in freedom, doing the right thing, and demanding the inalienable rights this country talks about in the Declaration of Independence. We all deserve those rights.

I'm wondering whether some people might look at their Asian friends and ask, "Why aren't they always stepping up like Yuri Kochiyama did? Why won't you join me? Why are you willing to just work hard and stay out of trouble when you see the rest of us suffering?" Do you think there's any of that tension? I'm curious about your thoughts.

Sarah Feng: I think a lot of it stems from cultural perspectives. I'm speaking from my perspective as a Chinese American, as I mentioned before. A lot of our parents and grandparents came here from China.

There's an interesting political divide within the Asian community, especially by generation. I think younger generations tend to be more liberal, while older generations grew up in a communist country. For them, American freedom and democracy may be especially important, and anything that resembles communism can be something they're strongly against.

They may want to keep their heads down, enjoy their democracy and freedom, and follow the model minority myth: work hard, don't speak up against anything, and don't cause trouble.

I think a lot of this comes from the cultural backgrounds of our parents and grandparents. That's how I see it from a Chinese American perspective.

Donzel Leggett: Yes, I think that's right. If you're an immigrant, it's different from being someone whose family has been here for generations. If you're African American and can trace your lineage back through slavery, your experience and history are different.

My family was brought to the Caribbean islands and enslaved, so that's a different experience and history, too. But there's also a similar mindset in some ways.

My grandparents gave me messages like, "We couldn't do this because of segregation. You have an opportunity now, and you must take it. Everything you deserve, go get it."

That was the message I received: work hard, but remember that you deserve what you've earned. Don't let anybody take anything from you. Don't accept anything less. You're not better than anybody else, but you're as good as anyone. Every right that everybody else has, you deserve, too.

That's different from the experience of someone who has recently come from a country where their rights weren't guaranteed and then arrives in a country where they have some rights. I can understand how that perspective might differ and how it could create tensions.

Sarah, you mentioned your personal experiences as a Chinese American. I said earlier that you're an incredible young woman. You're obviously a fantastic student, you're well-spoken, and you've done research that nobody asked you to do. You're someone who pushes herself to do better.

I could see some people looking at you and saying, "She's being this model minority." Do you ever feel that your classmates see you that way? Do you feel any responsibility to speak against it? Does it put you in difficult situations with other minority classmates or with classmates from the majority group? Does it make you feel awkward? How does all of this make you feel?

Sarah Feng: Growing up, I think I internalized this connection between my accomplishments and my race. I don't know where it started. Maybe it was a comment or something else, but I began to feel that the work I did was somehow inexplicably linked to being Asian.

I definitely felt that growing up in school. If I was good at math, I would say things like, "It's because I'm Asian."

Looking back, I realize how toxic that is. I think I almost made it seem acceptable for my classmates to see it that way, which it isn't. Young Asian Americans should realize that their accomplishments come from their hard work, not from anything inherently linked to their race.

I definitely think those stereotypes created barriers for me and affected how I viewed myself. I think a lot of Chinese Americans can relate to linking their accomplishments to their race.

Donzel Leggett: You mentioned that you sometimes said things like, "I'm good at math because I'm Asian" or "I'm good at math because I'm Chinese." Have other people made you feel that way, too? Has it created any tension between you and your friends?

Sarah Feng: I've seen it in the media. For example, in Sixteen Candles, there's an Asian character who's portrayed as being good at math, and a gong sounds every time he's on screen.

I think the stereotype is reinforced a lot in the media. There are also small comments and jokes, like, "There's always an Asian person who's better than you." I've heard that from white classmates and other students who aren't Asian.

You internalize it, and then you might start using it as a joke yourself. I think a lot of it comes from seeing these ideas around us constantly in popular culture and the media. I can't cite specific moments, but I think it's the accumulation of all these little instances that fuels the stereotype.

Donzel Leggett: Yeah, yeah. You mentioned earlier that, especially since the advent of COVID, there has been an increase in hate directed at people of Asian descent who outwardly appear Asian. People call it Asian hate or AAPI hate. There have been attacks, and some of these attacks have been carried out by African Americans.

Why do you think that's the case? Do you think it's related to what you talked about earlier—the manufactured conflict between groups that once worked together? Do you think it's because of the model minority myth? What do you think has contributed to it?

Sarah Feng: I think the tensions I talked about earlier could definitely play a role. But xenophobia in general is also so ingrained in our culture and media, including through subliminal messaging. We all receive these messages and have access to the same resources, so they influence everyone.

I think it may be related to those tensions, but it's also an overall issue of xenophobia in our society. When Trump called it the "Wuhan virus," the "China virus," or the "Chinese virus," that affected Asian Americans broadly. We're all Americans.

Xenophobia is so ingrained in our culture and society that I think mainstream culture and society are a major part of the problem.

Donzel Leggett: Yeah. You've been incredible. You started volunteering with us when you were around 14 or 15, so you've spent a lot of time helping get ARCC off the ground, furthering our vision of creating a racism-free world, spreading anti-racism, and developing yourself.

You went through our first course on learning how to transform yourself to be anti-racist. You mentioned seeing young Asian people at the marches after George Floyd's murder.

Why don't we see more Asian Americans taking the kinds of steps you've taken to embrace anti-racism and oppose hate? As you said, it wouldn't just benefit people experiencing racism because they're African American or Latino. It would also address the xenophobia we're seeing.

Why aren't more Asian Americans actively engaged?

Sarah Feng: I think, as I mentioned before, part of it comes from a cultural standpoint: the idea that we should stay quiet and keep our heads down.

There's also the perspective that racism is a white-and-Black issue and that Asian Americans don't really know what our place is in it, so we should stay out of it. But that's obviously not the case. It's a fight everyone has to participate in. Racism affects everyone, and it's not just a white-and-Black issue.

I think this idea is often expressed in Asian communities: that racism isn't our problem and that we don't have a place in the fight. A lot of it also comes down to generational differences. I definitely feel that younger generations are more active, but they're also working to teach older generations why these issues matter, why we have to speak out, and why staying silent doesn't help us. It actually harms us.

We also have to confront the racism that exists within our own communities.

I didn't touch on this earlier, but growing up as a Chinese American, I observed a lot of anti-Blackness and colorism in Asian culture, particularly East Asian culture. I definitely saw and heard it growing up.

Even in mainstream Asian culture, there's a strong emphasis on keeping your skin white. Skin whitening is treated as a beauty standard and is all over mainstream media. Ideas about Black criminality are also pretty prevalent in Asian communities.

Sarah Feng: As college approaches, affirmative action is another topic that's often discussed. It's widely misunderstood in the Asian community.

Obviously, there are different perspectives on it. I think we often ignore why affirmative action was implemented, its history, and how it can establish a common ground. We don't always talk about how it addresses the effects of oppression against minorities like African Americans, or about the benefits of affirmative action and the importance of having a diverse workforce and a diverse school community.

Instead, people often focus on negative manifestations of affirmative action, such as the Harvard lawsuit and the idea that Asian applicants were automatically marked as having "no personality." Obviously, there may be ways to improve certain aspects of the system, but I think it's important first to understand why affirmative action exists and why it's necessary, rather than automatically villainizing African Americans.

That's how discussions of affirmative action often appear in Asian communities, and I've personally observed it a lot. Understanding the history behind affirmative action was fundamental to shifting my own perspective and the perspectives of people around me.

Donzel Leggett: That was awesome. That segment alone is important because it's a topic very few people want to talk about. But we have to have these kinds of conversations.

I'm so proud of you for educating yourself. You're someone who's probably going to be able to get into any school you want. But there may be a circumstance where you're on the list to get into a particular school and someone else is at a greater economic disadvantage or belongs to a minority group that's less represented. I can see how that could create a conflict.

What I'm happy about is that you've done the research to understand where these concerns come from. Even more importantly, it sounds like you've talked to your friends about them and tried to help them understand, too.

That's what ARCC is all about, and that's why I said earlier that you personify what ARCC is trying to do. It's about educating yourself, first learning what racism is and opening your eyes to what it looks like, and recognizing that it's not just a Black-and-white issue. It's about understanding what anti-racism is and realizing that it takes work. You've got to do something.

Then you have to have the courage to do that work. You're doing it one-on-one with your friends, and you have the courage to do it with us. I just had to say that.

I have one other follow-up question. You mentioned how the media sends messages through comments like "China virus" or statements by the President of the United States that suggest something is bad about people from China. You also mentioned media and commercials promoting lighter skin as more beautiful.

The only way to overcome these messages is to have conversations and learn about other people, as you've done.

I don't know how diverse Breck School is, so I'm not going to comment on that. But, as part of ARCC, you've been on a team with Rosa and Valerie, who are both Haitian American artists, and Jeremiah, a white, cisgender man from the Midwest. You're a Chinese American, and you're all young people.

How have you worked to learn about their backgrounds and experiences? How have you used those relationships to broaden your perspective rather than relying on what someone might say about Haitians, white cisgender men, or other groups? How have you used those experiences to broaden your horizons and build your skills?

Sarah Feng: I think ARCC has definitely provided a space where I've been able to hear their stories, perspectives, and backgrounds. That's been really rewarding.

We had a discussion about school systems. Breck is a pretty "woke" school, so we talk about critical race theory and have many affinity spaces and groups. I'm a leader of our school's Asian affinity group.

We have these spaces and support systems for students of color. Hearing Valerie and Miss Adrian talk about how they've struggled with microaggressions and with getting support for affinity spaces, and hearing about their experiences as African American students, has helped me recognize my own privilege.

My school has provided me with safe spaces where I can do this work. I think it would be easy to get stuck in a bubble and say, "My school is so woke, and I can do all these things, so other schools probably have them, too." But there's a lot of work still to be done at other schools and in other places.

Hearing their stories emphasizes how I can use my voice and how privileged I am. It gives me the opportunity to use my voice to advocate for others.

Donzel Leggett: Awesome. Again, that's a real jewel of a synopsis, and I'm sure people will get tremendous value from it.

If there's one key message you want people to take away from today's episode, what would it be?

Sarah Feng: My last point would be to emphasize the power of unity. Take the time to identify and recognize your own biases. Look back at history and do your own research into where your stereotypes and your community's biases and stereotypes come from.

Understand that we're all in this together and that, many times, these biases stem from the same source: racism and white supremacy.

Look at examples of cross-cultural activism and racial solidarity, and recognize how powerful unity can be. We need to use that understanding to confront our own biases, identify their roots, and work to overcome them. Only by doing that can we move forward, fight against racism, and unite to confront the bigger issue at hand.

Donzel Leggett: Wonderful.

Sarah, thank you so much for today. I learned a lot just listening to you, and I'm sure the audience will walk away feeling enriched.

I also want to thank you for all the work you're doing with ARCC. You have been and continue to be one of our hardest-working volunteers, and you're making a tremendous difference.

I can personally attest to the schedule this young lady keeps. I say she's an incredible young woman, but she's an everyday young woman who does incredible things. She's not a superwoman. She doesn't have superpowers, and she doesn't show up in the Marvel Universe. She's a person who's doing amazing things, and all of us can do what Sarah is doing if we want to.

She's a teenager who's about to become a senior in high school. She's on social media, she has friends, and she has activities and hobbies. I hope she isn't into boys or anything like that—but who knows? She's a teenager!

My point is that she's not unlike any of us listening. You might be a little older or younger, or you might live in a different part of the country or the world, but you can do what Sarah is doing. You just have to find the time. You have to make the time.

This is what we're all about at ARCC: standing up, speaking out, and taking sustained action. It's also about continually learning. You heard Sarah talk about what she's learning, the research she's done, and how she's sharing it not only here but also with her friends. She talked about what she's learned about affirmative action and how she's passed that knowledge on to others.

I think you're a great example of what we're trying to do and what it will take to change things in this country, whether we're talking about eradicating racism or changing the gun laws that need to be changed.

Each of us needs to take it upon ourselves to transform ourselves and influence and transform at least one other person, who can then do the same thing.

So again, thank you so much, Sarah, for everything you're doing. I think you're wonderful, and I know everyone listening will think the same thing.

By the way, for all our listeners, if you'd like to learn more about the history of Asian American and Pacific Islander Heritage Month, the history of Asian immigrants in the United States, and the connected histories of Asian Americans and African Americans—including how their communities worked together at various points—Sarah gave you a few examples involving Yuri Kochiyama, Frederick Douglass, and others.

Go back and listen to Episode 10 of Season One. We also discussed the model minority myth, where it came from, and its connection to Booker T. Washington. All of that is covered in Episode 10, Educating Yourself About Anti-Racism, Part Three: Anti-Racism in the Asian Community, featuring a discussion with Tommy Fung, who happens to be Sarah's dad.

Please go back and listen to that episode. We'll be right back after this short break to close out the show.

Donzel Leggett: What a wonderful segment with Sarah.

To find the ARCC of Change podcast with Donzel Leggett and learn more about the Anti-Racism Commitment Coalition, or ARCC, please visit joinarcc.org.

You can also subscribe to the ARCC of Change with Donzel Leggett on your favorite podcast-hosting sites. I greatly look forward to our next episode and another opportunity to inspire you to become part of the movement that will change the world by eradicating racism once and for all.

Until next time, stay safe and continue to ask yourself, "Am I doing enough?" Remember that none of us are doing enough as long as racism and hate still exist.

Thanks for listening, and goodbye.

The ARCC of Change podcast with Donzel Leggett is brought to you by the Anti-Racism Commitment Coalition. To learn more about ARCC, donate to our cause, and join the coalition, visit joinarcc.org.

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